15 years ago today.

[Neilhoodwasmyhero]

Accies lost their appeal against the 15 point deduction, which neatly consigned us to the seaside league. Just failing to make the top six, while disappointing, isn't actually too bad, considering where we've been.

[redandwhite1874]

Great point, well made.

[silverfox]

I think we would all agree and are thankful that Accies have progressed in 15 years since the points deduction and all the ramifications therefater.

However, I think it can be difficult to be objective about a season if you constantly measure it against those events.

I make no apology in being disappointed in a season that with better planning, Accies could have been in the top three.

[Todd_is_God]

Agreed.

Being in the Third Division at one point can't continually be used as a retort to any criticism of current performance.

[glasgow accie]

^^^THIS^^^

[AmanAccie]

3 weeks ago we were worrying about getting dragged into the playoffs. Now were looking good for 7th. We now have time to strengthen and prepare for next season. Things are ok just now, I'll take that!

[redandwhite1874]

I think we would all agree and are thankful that Accies have progressed in 15 years since the points deduction and all the ramifications therefater.

However, I think it can be difficult to be objective about a season if you constantly measure it against those events.

I make no apology in being disappointed in a season that with better planning, Accies could have been in the top three.

Just better planning was required to get top 3? Perhaps if we were lucky and retained all the people we had in place we could have done that. It would have been truly astonishing but maybe we could have. Take out the 4 hardest to replace, and perhaps most effective, people at the club; including 2 people you could say were part of the foundations over a decade and I think it would take far, far more than planning to maintain that.

For me the myth that some investment and an experienced manager would have continued the same level of glory is being repeated to the point of almost certainty for some. For instance third might have been a reasonable goal for a certain club in Lanarkshire at the start of the season; who had stability, some investment (certainly in terms of the kind of wages we have structured around currently) and an experienced manager. We didn't strengthen in the window and that is a reality and failing but the real challenge was getting the club back on an even keel after the turmoil of January and loss of key staff. It would also be interesting know how much guys like MacDonald, Swanson, Pearson etc are on to gauge if they were realistic targets for us?

Many clubs have struggled after the loss of a hugely effective and influential manager; let alone a small club like ours who were already over performing and operating with the smallest first team budget. Man U went for Moyes and gave him cash for example.

[silverfox]

I think we would all agree and are thankful that Accies have progressed in 15 years since the points deduction and all the ramifications therefater.

However, I think it can be difficult to be objective about a season if you constantly measure it against those events.

I make no apology in being disappointed in a season that with better planning, Accies could have been in the top three.

Just better planning was required to get top 3? Perhaps if we were lucky and retained all the people we had in place we could have done that. It would have been truly astonishing but maybe we could have. Take out the 4 hardest to replace, and perhaps most effective, people at the club; including 2 people you could say were part of the foundations over a decade and I think it would take far, far more than planning to maintain that.

For me the myth that some investment and an experienced manager would have continued the same level of glory is being repeated to the point of almost certainty for some. For instance third might have been a reasonable goal for a certain club in Lanarkshire at the start of the season; who had stability, some investment (certainly in terms of the kind of wages we have structured around currently) and an experienced manager. We didn't strengthen in the window and that is a reality and failing but the real challenge was getting the club back on an even keel after the turmoil of January and loss of key staff. It would also be interesting know how much guys like MacDonald, Swanson, Pearson etc are on to gauge if they were realistic targets for us?

Many clubs have struggled after the loss of a hugely effective and influential manager; let alone a small club like ours who were already over performing and operating with the smallest first team budget. Man U went for Moyes and gave him cash for example.

You're right in so far as no one can say what would have happened if Accies had hired another manager. Well we probably could ; he wouldn't have been given the time Martin has been given, he would be on his way.

As regards planning, Accies have actively embraced the dynamic model of being a selling club where players and management can move on to further their careers.This model means that approaches can be made at any time, however whilst no one really saw the management team moving on in Jan, was that a failing under this fast moving model..... given the run Accies were on and Alex's profile as a fast emerging manager?

We were also lead to believe that there were over 60 applications of the highest calibre for the managers position, and yes I know that doesn't guarantee anything, but possibly the apparent standard could have softened some the blow of losing Alex, but as regarding your mythology point ............we will never know.

It looks as though the money generated from the business in Jan may be spent on the Accies dome, so I have no idea whether we could have afforded any of the players you mention, but personally I would take McDonald for Nigel any day of the week and hope the quality of signings will be better next season than this January's.

Since I have been supporting Accies (15 years) there have been huge successes, and I would like to challenge your view that if we achieve success then we are "over performing", as surely that wouldn't be enough to explain this sustained phenomena on its own?

[hughjarse6309]

A (hopefully) balanced view......

1/ Given where we were 15 years ago it is little short of a miracle where we are now/

or

2/ Given the great start to the season, it is somewhat disappointing that we have ended up not challenging for a European berth.


Merit in both arguments, methinks, but the balanced view (surely) is that we would have taken survival at the beginning of the campaign, and only the fact that we started it so brilliantly (and unexpectedly) naturally raised hopes; Who amongst us honestly did not expect the wheels to fall off on a weekly basis, and were pleasantly surprised to be proved wrong, week after week? In the end, of course, the loss of key personnel and some possibly misguided remedies have meant that we are where we are. Having said that, recent results have given us at least some hope for the next campaign.

[really?]

I think what happened 15yrs ago is directly responsible for where we are today.

We were struggling, in terminal decline - the points deduction gave the Club huge publicity and the incentive to prove itself.

There was the sense of injustice - football clubs and fans like to play the victim.

(A perceived sense of injustice with added victim mentality - we love it, don't we?)

Anyway, Accies' trajectory has been almost continually upwards since that dark hour.

I think, in some ways, it was a good thing.